RE: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS

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RE: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS

Uwe Schindler
Hi Mark,

In my opinion, replacing the key is a bad idea, as now old releases (released by your old key) cannot be verified anymore. On apache.org is only *one* version of this file available, that gets replaced on every release - so the old keys should be persistent. You should add the key to the file.

-----
Uwe Schindler
H.-H.-Meier-Allee 63, D-28213 Bremen
http://www.thetaphi.de
eMail: [hidden email]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 1:52 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS
>
> Author: markrmiller
> Date: Mon Jun 14 23:51:57 2010
> New Revision: 954674
>
> URL: http://svn.apache.org/viewvc?rev=954674&view=rev
> Log:
> change my key
>
> Modified:
>     lucene/java/dist/KEYS
>
> Modified: lucene/java/dist/KEYS
> URL:
> http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/lucene/java/dist/KEYS?rev=954674&r1=95467
> 3&r2=954674&view=diff
> ==========================================================
> ====================
> --- lucene/java/dist/KEYS (original)
> +++ lucene/java/dist/KEYS Mon Jun 14 23:51:57 2010
> @@ -367,60 +367,60 @@ EXxVbgGadMHBaufCEBm04uU=
>  =DT04
>  -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
>
> -pub   4096R/EB0199F8 2009-09-17
> +pub   4096R/78796AC8 2010-06-14
>  uid                  Mark Robert Miller (CODE SIGNING KEY)
> <[hidden email]>
> -sub   4096R/3416EB41 2009-09-17
> +sub   4096R/1D6080E5 2010-06-14
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>  -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
>
>  pub   4096R/E1EE085F 2009-11-05
>



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Re: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS

Mark Miller-3
Yeah, I considered that - but then decided its prob better not to keep
it around. What I'd really like to do is revoke my old key, but I don't
have it anymore and I also don't have the revocation cert to do it.

Technically, the key went out on a laptop (I know to who, and I know its
been reformatted, but I didn't see that happen - and it's since been
sold to someone else).

Unfortunately the Key is on key servers out there, but there is no way
to revoke it that I can find without access to the original revocation
cert I made.


- Mark

On 6/15/10 1:50 AM, Uwe Schindler wrote:

> Hi Mark,
>
> In my opinion, replacing the key is a bad idea, as now old releases (released by your old key) cannot be verified anymore. On apache.org is only *one* version of this file available, that gets replaced on every release - so the old keys should be persistent. You should add the key to the file.
>
> -----
> Uwe Schindler
> H.-H.-Meier-Allee 63, D-28213 Bremen
> http://www.thetaphi.de
> eMail: [hidden email]
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]]
>> Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 1:52 AM
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS
>>
>> Author: markrmiller
>> Date: Mon Jun 14 23:51:57 2010
>> New Revision: 954674
>>
>> URL: http://svn.apache.org/viewvc?rev=954674&view=rev
>> Log:
>> change my key
>>
>> Modified:
>>      lucene/java/dist/KEYS
>>
>> Modified: lucene/java/dist/KEYS
>> URL:
>> http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/lucene/java/dist/KEYS?rev=954674&r1=95467
>> 3&r2=954674&view=diff
>> ==========================================================
>> ====================
>> --- lucene/java/dist/KEYS (original)
>> +++ lucene/java/dist/KEYS Mon Jun 14 23:51:57 2010
>> @@ -367,60 +367,60 @@ EXxVbgGadMHBaufCEBm04uU=
>>   =DT04
>>   -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
>>
>> -pub   4096R/EB0199F8 2009-09-17
>> +pub   4096R/78796AC8 2010-06-14
>>   uid                  Mark Robert Miller (CODE SIGNING KEY)
>> <[hidden email]>
>> -sub   4096R/3416EB41 2009-09-17
>> +sub   4096R/1D6080E5 2010-06-14
>>   -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
>> -Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
>> +Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux)
>>
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>>   -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
>>
>>   pub   4096R/E1EE085F 2009-11-05
>>
>
>
>
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--
- Mark

http://www.lucidimagination.com

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RE: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS

Uwe Schindler
But you still need the public key, to verify the old downloaded artifact. And that is I am talking about. Which releases were signed by that key? The keyfile is also migrated to We also have the keys of very old committers in it no longer active. The keyfile should hold all public keys used to sign any previous release available on archive.apache.org!

-----
Uwe Schindler
H.-H.-Meier-Allee 63, D-28213 Bremen
http://www.thetaphi.de
eMail: [hidden email]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mark Miller [mailto:[hidden email]]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 10:42 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS
>
> Yeah, I considered that - but then decided its prob better not to keep it
> around. What I'd really like to do is revoke my old key, but I don't have it
> anymore and I also don't have the revocation cert to do it.
>
> Technically, the key went out on a laptop (I know to who, and I know its been
> reformatted, but I didn't see that happen - and it's since been sold to
> someone else).
>
> Unfortunately the Key is on key servers out there, but there is no way to
> revoke it that I can find without access to the original revocation cert I made.
>
>
> - Mark
>
> On 6/15/10 1:50 AM, Uwe Schindler wrote:
> > Hi Mark,
> >
> > In my opinion, replacing the key is a bad idea, as now old releases (released
> by your old key) cannot be verified anymore. On apache.org is only *one*
> version of this file available, that gets replaced on every release - so the old
> keys should be persistent. You should add the key to the file.
> >
> > -----
> > Uwe Schindler
> > H.-H.-Meier-Allee 63, D-28213 Bremen
> > http://www.thetaphi.de
> > eMail: [hidden email]
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]]
> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 1:52 AM
> >> To: [hidden email]
> >> Subject: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS
> >>
> >> Author: markrmiller
> >> Date: Mon Jun 14 23:51:57 2010
> >> New Revision: 954674
> >>
> >> URL: http://svn.apache.org/viewvc?rev=954674&view=rev
> >> Log:
> >> change my key
> >>
> >> Modified:
> >>      lucene/java/dist/KEYS
> >>
> >> Modified: lucene/java/dist/KEYS
> >> URL:
> >>
> http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/lucene/java/dist/KEYS?rev=954674&r1=9546
> >> 7
> >> 3&r2=954674&view=diff
> >>
> ==========================================================
> >> ====================
> >> --- lucene/java/dist/KEYS (original)
> >> +++ lucene/java/dist/KEYS Mon Jun 14 23:51:57 2010
> >> @@ -367,60 +367,60 @@ EXxVbgGadMHBaufCEBm04uU=
> >>   =DT04
> >>   -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
> >>
> >> -pub   4096R/EB0199F8 2009-09-17
> >> +pub   4096R/78796AC8 2010-06-14
> >>   uid                  Mark Robert Miller (CODE SIGNING KEY)
> >> <[hidden email]>
> >> -sub   4096R/3416EB41 2009-09-17
> >> +sub   4096R/1D6080E5 2010-06-14
> >>   -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
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> >>   -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
> >>
> >>   pub   4096R/E1EE085F 2009-11-05
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email] For
> > additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
> >
>
>
> --
> - Mark
>
> http://www.lucidimagination.com
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email] For additional
> commands, e-mail: [hidden email]



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RE: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS

Uwe Schindler
In reply to this post by Mark Miller-3
> Technically, the key went out on a laptop (I know to who, and I know its been
> reformatted, but I didn't see that happen - and it's since been sold to
> someone else)

So it's still fine for somebody to verify that at the time you made the release the key was fine and you can verify that somebody at apache did the release. By revoking or removing the kesy you make all previous releases no longer signed?

> Unfortunately the Key is on key servers out there, but there is no way to
> revoke it that I can find without access to the original revocation cert I made.

But the artifacts are already signed with that key are still valid? So the key is simply *unused* but still valid to check the artifacts.

> - Mark
>
> On 6/15/10 1:50 AM, Uwe Schindler wrote:
> > Hi Mark,
> >
> > In my opinion, replacing the key is a bad idea, as now old releases (released
> by your old key) cannot be verified anymore. On apache.org is only *one*
> version of this file available, that gets replaced on every release - so the old
> keys should be persistent. You should add the key to the file.
> >
> > -----
> > Uwe Schindler
> > H.-H.-Meier-Allee 63, D-28213 Bremen
> > http://www.thetaphi.de
> > eMail: [hidden email]
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]]
> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 1:52 AM
> >> To: [hidden email]
> >> Subject: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS
> >>
> >> Author: markrmiller
> >> Date: Mon Jun 14 23:51:57 2010
> >> New Revision: 954674
> >>
> >> URL: http://svn.apache.org/viewvc?rev=954674&view=rev
> >> Log:
> >> change my key
> >>
> >> Modified:
> >>      lucene/java/dist/KEYS
> >>
> >> Modified: lucene/java/dist/KEYS
> >> URL:
> >>
> http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/lucene/java/dist/KEYS?rev=954674&r1=9546
> >> 7
> >> 3&r2=954674&view=diff
> >>
> ==========================================================
> >> ====================
> >> --- lucene/java/dist/KEYS (original)
> >> +++ lucene/java/dist/KEYS Mon Jun 14 23:51:57 2010
> >> @@ -367,60 +367,60 @@ EXxVbgGadMHBaufCEBm04uU=
> >>   =DT04
> >>   -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
> >>
> >> -pub   4096R/EB0199F8 2009-09-17
> >> +pub   4096R/78796AC8 2010-06-14
> >>   uid                  Mark Robert Miller (CODE SIGNING KEY)
> >> <[hidden email]>
> >> -sub   4096R/3416EB41 2009-09-17
> >> +sub   4096R/1D6080E5 2010-06-14
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> >> dLPMu
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> >>
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> >> LXEma
> >>
> +tElN8xdxGDR244dDUSR/0q4pbOzsCgVr/eaQJL6ecVocrOQYOW/vx8E4TGUC
> >> uumm
> >>
> +Q5jFUUWomTNBBgW0KScDkLzmjYIJ31CoShQoj+yLfWdV9g7mHG8RUKyYF6
> >> /M2d7A
> >>
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> >> PxPlJ
> >>
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> >> TvO
> >>
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> >>
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> >> FjRAAv6TB
> >>
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> >> VJ0KZ5
> >>
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> >> CN23
> >>
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> >> TC
> >>
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> >> HxL
> >>
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> >>
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> >>
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> >> Pt
> >>
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> >> 03+SQ
> >>
> +/x3mtXNQUihZAK82/aqhitd1Zi/cN+lsITBj4B4rfFIUOhXh9UivYyjWsJGklCcs
> >>
> +bUIToYedGfq4XyopJE/C49qGO5/xmXRBByuGP3ESRMLwdMoe3dIEBMBFlqv
> >> r267C
> >> +5MNuLYxBjO6nun+BZ834FLWDVt1qKpQtd01g9ZM=
> >> +=L5LB
> >>   -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
> >>
> >>   pub   4096R/E1EE085F 2009-11-05
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email] For
> > additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
> >
>
>
> --
> - Mark
>
> http://www.lucidimagination.com
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email] For additional
> commands, e-mail: [hidden email]



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Re: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS

Mark Miller-3
In reply to this post by Uwe Schindler
It shouldn't hold a key you don't trust 100%. Presumably the very old
committers are still happy that their keys are in their possession.

On 6/15/10 5:43 AM, Uwe Schindler wrote:

> But you still need the public key, to verify the old downloaded artifact. And that is I am talking about. Which releases were signed by that key? The keyfile is also migrated to We also have the keys of very old committers in it no longer active. The keyfile should hold all public keys used to sign any previous release available on archive.apache.org!
>
> -----
> Uwe Schindler
> H.-H.-Meier-Allee 63, D-28213 Bremen
> http://www.thetaphi.de
> eMail: [hidden email]
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Mark Miller [mailto:[hidden email]]
>> Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 10:42 AM
>> To: [hidden email]
>> Subject: Re: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS
>>
>> Yeah, I considered that - but then decided its prob better not to keep it
>> around. What I'd really like to do is revoke my old key, but I don't have it
>> anymore and I also don't have the revocation cert to do it.
>>
>> Technically, the key went out on a laptop (I know to who, and I know its been
>> reformatted, but I didn't see that happen - and it's since been sold to
>> someone else).
>>
>> Unfortunately the Key is on key servers out there, but there is no way to
>> revoke it that I can find without access to the original revocation cert I made.
>>
>>
>> - Mark
>>
>> On 6/15/10 1:50 AM, Uwe Schindler wrote:
>>> Hi Mark,
>>>
>>> In my opinion, replacing the key is a bad idea, as now old releases (released
>> by your old key) cannot be verified anymore. On apache.org is only *one*
>> version of this file available, that gets replaced on every release - so the old
>> keys should be persistent. You should add the key to the file.
>>>
>>> -----
>>> Uwe Schindler
>>> H.-H.-Meier-Allee 63, D-28213 Bremen
>>> http://www.thetaphi.de
>>> eMail: [hidden email]
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]]
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 1:52 AM
>>>> To: [hidden email]
>>>> Subject: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS
>>>>
>>>> Author: markrmiller
>>>> Date: Mon Jun 14 23:51:57 2010
>>>> New Revision: 954674
>>>>
>>>> URL: http://svn.apache.org/viewvc?rev=954674&view=rev
>>>> Log:
>>>> change my key
>>>>
>>>> Modified:
>>>>       lucene/java/dist/KEYS
>>>>
>>>> Modified: lucene/java/dist/KEYS
>>>> URL:
>>>>
>> http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/lucene/java/dist/KEYS?rev=954674&r1=9546
>>>> 7
>>>> 3&r2=954674&view=diff
>>>>
>> ==========================================================
>>>> ====================
>>>> --- lucene/java/dist/KEYS (original)
>>>> +++ lucene/java/dist/KEYS Mon Jun 14 23:51:57 2010
>>>> @@ -367,60 +367,60 @@ EXxVbgGadMHBaufCEBm04uU=
>>>>    =DT04
>>>>    -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
>>>>
>>>> -pub   4096R/EB0199F8 2009-09-17
>>>> +pub   4096R/78796AC8 2010-06-14
>>>>    uid                  Mark Robert Miller (CODE SIGNING KEY)
>>>> <[hidden email]>
>>>> -sub   4096R/3416EB41 2009-09-17
>>>> +sub   4096R/1D6080E5 2010-06-14
>>>>    -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
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>>>>    -----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
>>>>
>>>>    pub   4096R/E1EE085F 2009-11-05
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email] For
>>> additional commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> - Mark
>>
>> http://www.lucidimagination.com
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [hidden email] For additional
>> commands, e-mail: [hidden email]
>
>
>
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>


--
- Mark

http://www.lucidimagination.com

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Re: svn commit: r954674 - /lucene/java/dist/KEYS

Chris Hostetter-3

: It shouldn't hold a key you don't trust 100%. Presumably the very old
: committers are still happy that their keys are in their possession.

 * if you feel that people can still trust releases signed with that key,
   then it should stay in the KEYS file.
 * If you don't feel that people can still trust releases signed with that
   key, then removing that key from KEYS isn't enough -- those releases
   should also be verified and resigned with a key that can be trusted.

...that is the theory anyway, as i understand it.  Wether it's actaully
worth re-signing old releases (as a practical issue) is another matter.


-Hoss


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